open TELEMAC-MASCARET The mathematically superior suite of solvers

Dear all

I am trying to understand how to model harbour resonance (long wave / seiche interaction in a Harbour). I have instrumental data which show the water level within the harbour varying by up to 1.5 m over a period of approximately 2 minutes.

I have used Artemis and ran a model with period scanning from 2-250 seconds with a step of 4 seconds, over a model grid with 10 m resolution over a couple of km.

The results how wave height and free surface variation. My question is is this the best way in Telemac to model such a phenomena, (long waves are produced by storm waves that interact with a harbour), using Artemis with period scanning.

Or should i be using artemis with random wave or telemac 3d? Im looking for an output which would show the presence of a 1m> surface water variation with a period of approximately 2m within the basin.

Many thanks for any advice.

Hello

We think that you may be able to get away with ARTEMIS, particularly if you have no transmission of long waves through your harbour structures. You can certainly do a period scanning. Note for the mesh resolution that as your long waves may be bound waves, these will break-up into shorter waves.

Otherwise, to make sure, you may have to use TELEMAC-3D (at least 3 layers, with non-hydrostatic option, very fine resolution), although TELEMAC-3D does not include wave breaking.

Finally, we'd be interested in your results and analysis -- feel free to contact us directly or through this form.

Best regards,
Sébastien.

Dear Sebastian,

I have been making several models coupling Tomawac with Telemac 3d (non-hydrostatic)

I can see wave driven currents in 2d and 3d results when compared to running the model without coupling, however i do not see any variations in the free surface elevation or water depth in 2d or 3d as a result of wave activity / wave set-up or long wave activity. The results show a nice smooth tidal curve.

Perhaps im not understanding something or have something wrond. Im using a mesh with 100 m in deep ocean to 20 m at harbour scale. Im using TPOX tidal data and imposing a sig. wave height of 8 m on the boundary.

The Tomwawac results show sig wave height and period propagating into teh model and tidal currents + wave currents look ok.

Many thanks for any help.

Hello,

You are probably right -- the scientific committee had a meeting not long ago and it was announced that the direct coupling (as opposed to through files) did not incorporate the physics it should. I am sorry you had to find this the hard way.

Can you update your code to release 1, v7p1r1 (or to the current version of the trunk) and let me know ?

Hope this helps,
Sébastien.

Hi

I have updated the code using SVN to V7P1 (running on win 64bit) svn.opentelemac.org/svn/opentelemac/tags/v7p1r1/

I have re-run the model but get the same results, all free surfaces show nice smooth tidal curves with water level elevation, no wave influence.

I have noticed in v7p1 the 3d file is corrupted (not every time). On some model runs, blue kanue cannot open the file: error says "unknown file format". A re-run of the same model fixes it.

I will try the trunk code to see if there is any difference.

Many thanks

I think this thread might no longer be an artemis thread, however

I have had no success in seeing any wave influence on the 3d, 2d or tomawac free surface or depth results with VP1 or VP0.

I have noticed running the same model with VP0 and VP1 give different results (see attached picture), unsure what this problem is.

The attached picture shows teh same time step running the same model, top is VP0 bottom is VP1.

Many thanks.

I think this thread might no longer be an artemis thread, however

I have had no success in seeing any wave influence on the 3d, 2d or tomawa, free surface or depth results with VP1 or VP0.

I have noticed running the same model with TOMAWAC VP0 and VP1 give different results (see attached picture), unsure what this problem is.

The attached picture shows the Hm0 with same time step running the same model in both versions, top is VP0 bottom is VP1.

Many thanks.

Thank you for sending the picture -- here attached.


Also, I have moved your post from the ARTEMIS to the TOMAWAC area.

Best regards,
Sébastien

Hello

Could you please post your case (geometry, steering file and fortran file) and your result (the slf result)

Best regards

Thierry

cas,slf and cli files.